CBC and the "Abolish Abortion" wish

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choice joyce
CBC and the "Abolish Abortion" wish

 

choice joyce

I know this topic has been discussed and the thread closed, but I would like to add more perspective, if I may. The Wish List controversy is ongoing, and there is now a stronger pro-choice presence there. Please check out the pro-choice Editorial #2 I wrote for the site at [url=http://www.cbc.ca/wish/]http://www.cbc.ca/wish/[/url] and also the many comments (both pro and anti) under the anti-choice Editorial #1 [url=http://www.cbc.ca/wish/2007/06/editorial_1.html]http://www.cbc.ca/wish/2...

I know this contest is stupid, it's become a farce, and it's very unfortunate that it got hijacked by right-wingers and anti-choicers. But the CBC doesn't want to stop it for fear of censorship criticism.

"Abolish Abortion" is the #1 wish by a wide margin, which may indicate growing confidence within the anti-choice movement, and their increased hopes for a chance to re-open the debate and recriminalize abortion. Even though we might dislike the contest itself, this is a venue for us to show strong and principled opposition to their views. I believe it's always important to stand up for what's right and fight injustice, and we should not let the anti's control the debate here, or elsewhere. Unfortunately, we can't really afford to be complacent about abortion rights anymore in this country.

So I invite you to please take a look - you don't have to join Facebook to make comments on the CBC website. Thank you!

Joyce Arthur, Abortion Rights Coalition of Canada, [url=http://www.arcc-cdac.ca]www.arcc-cdac.ca[/url]

choice joyce

Forgot to mention, if you ARE a member of Facebook or can join, you can support the #3 wish that "Canada would remain pro-choice" here: [url=http://www.facebook.com/sgroup/subgroup.php?oid=2392827649&sub_oid=23554...

Makwa Makwa's picture

This is the risk that are undertaken when media is misunderstood. Whateve CBC producers came up with this idea prolly thot that the typical student oreinted 'facebook' was a buy into a cool young demographic. So would I. Who could consider that the organized right wing blogosphere could organize such a sudden and dynamic hijack? Well, now we know. Unmodded space is always vulnurable to attack from the Xtian fundies and the criminal racists and must never be left open to similar threat.

remind remind's picture

quote:


Originally posted by Makwa:
[b]...Who could consider that the organized right wing blogosphere could organize...Unmodded space is always vulnurable to attack from the Xtian fundies and the criminal racists and must never be left open to similar threat.[/b]

In an actual fact, I would have considered the anti-rights crowd would get something going and have been expecting a national action for awhile now. I just wasn't expecting it to be the CBC.

Advertising dollars, in part, control the media, in every form. If you look in the Christian Government Canada thread, you will see exactly how many and who is working to try and make Canada a theocracy. And their lies start on the home page.

babblerwannabe

To everyone who has facebook:

I found a much better way to organize all the pro choice supporters on facebook.

Abolish Abortion is still the number one wish, but the pro choice wish is catching up , it is now in the number 2 spot. The reason? Because I have created a pro choice group that corresponds to the pro choice wish on the wish lit.

I have spent a lot of times on this and I am going to ask you guys to take a look at the pro choice facebook group I created.

I created this group for the purpose of mobilizing all the pro choice people on facebook. The summary of my group clearly states the CBC Canadian wish list and the urgency of adding support for the pro choice wish so that the “abolish abortion” wish will not be the number one wish on July 1.

[url=http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2421536323]http://www.facebook.com...

The main purpose is *not* just for you to join this group. I created this group for promotional purpose, as there is no other effective ways of “inviting all your friends” to the pro choice wish

From becoming a member of this group, you can invite all your friends and inform them about the Anti-choice wish on the Canadian wish list.

I hope everyone who has facebook here will join and promote my group to their friends.

A little information:

When a facebook user creates a group on facebook or when a user join a facebook group, they have the option to "invite their friends" to the group, this *is* the reason my group has grew from 0 members to 1400 members in just 3 days. This *is* the only group that is made for the purpose of promoting the pro choice wish and is the only efficient way of promoting the pro choice wish to everyone else on facebook. If you really want to knock off the “abolish abortion” wish from the number one position. Join this group, and tell all your friends about it.

*unfortunately, facebook has decided to disable my account for no good reasons, but you can still join and invite people, the only difference is I won’t be available for contact right now. Hopefully, I will get my account back soon.*

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

writer writer's picture

It's a great idea. I've already joined the group, and invited my friends. So far, 22 of my friends have joined, too. My next step is to go through the 1,665 names who haven't replied to an invitation and nudge the ones I know.

Edited to add: Let us know about your account. Do you want us to spread the word about this?

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ]

babblerwannabe

quote:


Originally posted by writer:
[b]It's a great idea. I've already joined the group, and invited my friends. So far, 22 of my friends have joined, too. My next step is to go through the 1,665 names who haven't replied to an invitation and nudge the ones I know.

Edited to add: Let us know about your account. Do you want us to spread the word about this?

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ][/b]


Thank you writer, you are doing great works.

If you click to “see all members’, you will know that about 1700 facebook users are invited to the group, we need to have more. The Abolish Abortion group is doing the same thing.

I contacted the facebook people a while ago, I said I did not spam or do anything and did not know why they disabled my account. It is pretty ridiculous to suppress my freedom of speech.

Feel free to spread the words about my group, I created the facebook group just so that people will learn about the pro choice wish on the CBC Canadian wish list.

Hopefully when I get my account back, I can add someone to be the admin. I need someone trustworthy so they can delete hateful comments/spam and make the appropriate changes that are necessary. And someone will be able to take on the role of the admin when one of the admin's account is disabled.

I found out that promoting people to the “officer” position does not give them any real power, what a waste of time that was.

But anyways, fortunately, the group looks fine as it is now, and it can go on without me for a least a short while.

I want to stress to everyone that joining the group alone is not enough, the group is not the pro choice wish, the group is for promotional purpose and to link people to the pro choice wish so they can add their support.

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

babblerwannabe

One more thing, as a last ditch attempt, when I dot back my account (or if), I might send a mass messages to all those who did not reply to the invite and tell them to join the wish list and add their support to the pro choice wish (although they might have already but they just didn’t join my group)

I don’t know if that would piss off a lot of people, but I just hope we will keep up the momentum. I don’t want to sound conceited, but there is really no other effective ways to knock down the “Abolish Abortion” wish from the number one spot.

So i strongly encourage everyone to join and add their support to the pro choice wish and finally, invite their friends to the group so they can do the same thing.

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

writer writer's picture

[i](Never mind! - I found the answer.)[/i]

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ]

babblerwannabe

Thank you for speaking out for me, I don’t want to make a big issue about it. The facebook people emailed me and said they will look into it as soon as possible. *shrugs*

We’ll see.

remind remind's picture

Have joined the group, and have emailed contacts with the link to join and vote, and a link to the group.

writer writer's picture

Holy shit! I was just writing a reply on facebook about this situation and the following message popped up:

quote:

Warning! Your account could be disabled.

You are using this feature to spam other users. Continued misuse of Facebook's features will result in your account being disabled. If you have any questions or concerns, you can contact us at warning@facebook.com from your login address.


I was posting a message to the discussion board of the pro-choice wish! I have *not* been spamming.

babblerwannabe

Writer, the same thing happened to me.

I was *not* spamming.

Please do not post anymore, wait till the warning label is gone.

I had to wait for 12 hours to get rid of the warning label, even than, my account was *still* disabled* when I resume posting.

I don’t know why, this is horrible and I am so sick of Steve the prolifer and the wish creator of insinuating that I am a spammer.

Thank you for your help anyways, but you account will be disabled if you don't stop posting now.

writer writer's picture

On [url=http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=2355464304&topic=2700]facebook[/url], someone wrote:

quote:

It seems to say on the link that she sent out mass group invitations to everyone on the facebook site. Not sure if I would call that spamming but I'm certainly leaning that way. It's not something that would cross my mind cause I would never do it for fear of turning people off.

This is not the case. She has said she [b]might[/b] message people who've been invited to join her group but who have not responded if she gets her account back. [b]Not[/b] that she has sent invitations to everyone on facebook.

Sorry to deal with this here. I am still getting a message that accuses me of spamming, and that I will have my account disabled.

Yay, great project there, CBC!

Edited to add: babblerwannabe, don't worry, I'm not posting there as long as I get the warning.

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ]

babblerwannabe

Yeah, that’s the smart thing to do although my account was still disabled even when I had wait until the warning label was gone. It doesn’t make any sense. I am sorry I indirectly caused this problem for you.

[img]frown.gif" border="0[/img]

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

babblerwannabe

And I am sadden that people would put words into my mouth. I never said anything about sending a mass invitation to everyone on the facebook.

Steve Orlowski from [url=http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=2355464304&topic=2700]facebook[/url], please do not put words into my mouth, I am disappointed at certain people who are jumping to conclusion about my supposed *spamming*.

writer writer's picture

quote:


I am sorry I indirectly caused this problem for you.

I don't see it this way at all!

Edited to add: I can't even reply to private messages that my friends send to my Facebook account!

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ]

writer writer's picture

From the [url=http://www.facebook.com/wall.php?id=2392827649]CBC Wish List[/url] wall:

quote:

In regards to Casey's account to being disabled you asked why?

Because it's one thing to start wish about a topic, it's quite another thing to start or join a wish attacking a PERSON.

That's why.


I can't speak to that. But I can say that I have started no list of any kind, nor have I joined anything which personally attacks anyone, and yet Facebook is threatening to disable my account.

Why?

(And, of course, I can't respond on Facebook [b]because I am being warned that my account will be cut off[/b].)

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ]

babblerwannabe

I did not join her wish to attack her. In her wish to “restore the traditional definition of marriage”, she deleted *all* comments that questioned her group’s stance on homosexuality and same sex marriages. She does not allow *any* debate in her own anti-equal marriage wish. She is a lunatic and a hypocrite, her rhetoric is offensive and her opinions are hostile so I wouldn’t take her seriously.

She was the one coming to our pro choice wish and talking about how homosexuality is a lifestyle choice and how everyone can choose to be not gay because she has gotten over her *same sex attraction.*

I admitted that a couple of us did make fun of her supposed *ex-gayness* but that was done on the main discussion board, not on her wish about banning gay marriages.

[url=http://www.facebook.com/sgroup/subgroup.php?oid=2392827649&sub_oid=24581...

Her wish:

"THIS GROUP IS NOT FOR DEBATING. IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH THE WISH THAN DO NOT JOIN. IF YOU WANT TO DEBATE, PLEASE START YOUR OWN GROUP."

And her comment on homosexuality on the Pro Choice wish:

"I am liberated because I am NOT defined by my sexuality and I know that living the inclinations is a CHOICE.

Sexuality is a very small part of who we are, contrary to the absurd Freudian way of thinking that pervades our society. I think it's tragic that people define themselves by where they put their penises and vaginas. We are so much more than that."

[url=http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=2355464304&topic=2568&start=30]htt...

Is this not an attack on homosexuals that they are supposedly only about sex, and that they are defined by their sexuality? This is not an *attack* or an *insult* on homosexuals?

We all know that this is just about fighting dirty, we should just focus on promoting my group and when I do get my account back, would you be one of the admins, writer? I need more administrators for my group and I hope we can organize this a little more better and this can be more of a group effort, instead of just me, myself and I. People are not going to magically turn to the Canadian wish list.

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

writer writer's picture

Sure! And there is someone else who's posted to your group indicating she'd do admin, too. (Luckily, I let her know about your situation before I was shut down with the warning.)

While you (and I) are blocked from Facebook, I think it's worth encouraging those who come here from there to spread the news, and maybe let people know about this thread.

It might motivate others to act, and to add their vote to the wish [url=http://www.facebook.com/sgroup/subgroup.php?oid=2392827649&sub_oid=23554... Canada remain pro-choice[/url].

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ]

babblerwannabe

Even the so called "lifesite" is talking about the contest.

quote:

deleted.


[url=http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2007/jun/07061408.html]http://www.lifesite.n...

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

DavisMavis

[QUOTE]Originally posted by babblerwannabe:
[b]Even the so called "lifesite" is talking about it..[/b]

Eep, careful about linking there! [img]eek.gif" border="0[/img]

babblerwannabe

I am sorry, is this not allowed? I was only trying to point out the seriousness of this contest...

Unionist

quote:


Originally posted by babblerwannabe:
[b]I am sorry, is this not allowed? I was only trying to point out the seriousness of this contest...[/b]

1. I don't appreciate quotes from lifesite.

2. This contest is not serious. This particular emperor has no clothes.

babblerwannabe

quote:


Originally posted by unionist:
[b]

1. I don't appreciate quotes from lifesite.

2. This contest is not serious. This particular emperor has no clothes.[/b]


1. I don’t like the lifesite either.

2. This contest might not be serious, but it has influence on some of us. While you might not think this is something worth looking at, the wish list has been distressing and upsetting for some of us, and we will express our feelings about it.

[ 16 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

writer writer's picture

The pro-choice wish has broken 3,000, but is still in second place:

Top Wishes By Membership
4129 - Abolish Abortion in Canada
3014 - I wish that Canada would remain pro-choice

remind remind's picture

quote:


Originally posted by babblerwannabe:
[b]1. I don’t like the lifesite either.

2. This contest might not be serious, but it has influence on some of us. While you might not think this is something worth looking at, the wish list has been distressing and upsetting for some of us, and we will express our feelings about it.[/b]


Glad you stated this, it really isn't about those whom it doesn't affect!

babblerwannabe

quote:


Originally posted by writer:
[b]The pro-choice wish has broken 3,000, but is still in second place:

Top Wishes By Membership
4129 - Abolish Abortion in Canada
3014 - I wish that Canada would remain pro-choice[/b]


Yeah, it’s nice to know that all the efforts we have put into this wish is not completely wasted. I am thankful that we now have a huge chance to knock off the abolish abortion wish. I asked many people to support and join my group and although my effort is not being acknowledged by the wish creator or a lot of people, that doesn’t matter as long as the pro choice wish wins.

We are very close to the number one wish, i am happy!

writer writer's picture

[b]Top Wishes By Membership[/b]

4183 - Abolish Abortion in Canada
3135 - I wish that Canada would remain pro-choice

So, I've just received this from someone working at Facebook:

quote:

Please slow down account activity for a few days and the warning should go away on its own. If you get warned for using a specific feature, I recommend that you stop using the feature completely for a few days until the warning goes away. Let me know if you have any further questions.

So, the CBC sets up this "contest". The anti-choice crowd sets up a wish to take away women's rights. I respond. And now I can't do anything with elements of my account - some of which I hadn't used before the warning - for "a few days" ...

And the contest will end in a few days ...

Nice.

Way to go, CBC!

[ 18 June 2007: Message edited by: writer ]

500_Apples

Unionist,

This is slightly more important than any other run of the mill internet poll. The winning group will have a representative make his case on CBC to the nation.

Unionist

quote:


Originally posted by 500_Apples:
[b]Unionist,

This is slightly more important than any other run of the mill internet poll. The winning group will have a representative make his case on CBC to the nation.[/b]


1. The public broadcaster ought not to offer a platform to the "winner" of such a contest. If you like, start a "wish" to that effect.

2. No credibility should be given. If pro-choice forces participate and "lose", that's far worse than refusing to participate on principle.

3. If you think we can't afford to pass this up, then it never ends. We'll have to harass people to participate in, "I wish Preston Manning were Prime Minister", and "I wish Canada remains a capitalist country". No thank you.

4. "Making his case on CBC to the nation" is an oxymoron. The nation doesn't watch CBC. (j/k)

I think it's very wrong for progressive people to get sucked in to meaningless mob mania of this nature. I was unimpressed by the "greatest Canadian" madness. So Tommy Douglas won - wonderful - so what?

When they use these things to replace elections, I'll start worrying.

writer writer's picture

I'm sympathetic, unionist. But Facebook is a place where a lot of people are being directly exposed to this type of thing for the first time.

And one person did start a counter-wish, so that cat is out of that bag.

I'd rather not have people who are seeing what the right wing zealots are willing to do see us simply roll over. Or not bother to show up at all.

Unionist

You may be right, writer. We are sometimes embroiled in battles where we don't choose the battlefield. I still think we should look at alternative strategies.

Maybe starting our own campaigns proactively, rather than reacting?

Developing networks of people dedicated to this end?

It's the reactive thing I really don't like, but as you say, you can't always wish the cat back into the bag.

writer writer's picture

With the group babblerwannabe has created, just such a network [i]has[/i] been established. It will continue after the contest.

The question now is: How can it be managed? With babblerwannabe pulled as the administrator, there is no way to use this group for organizing.

remind remind's picture

quote:


Originally posted by writer:
[b]With the group babblerwannabe has created, just such a network [i]has[/i] been established. It will continue after the contest.

The question now is: How can it be managed? With babblerwannabe pulled as the administrator, there is no way to use this group for organizing.[/b]


Yes, that is the nasty thing about those types of group sub-forums, when the moderator/administrator gets banned. On another forum in the lead into the invasion of Iraq. There were a group of us Canadian women who started a sub-forum, or rather one person started and invited others.

Then suddenly a few days later the administrator got banned, everyone else could go to the group site except the administrator. But no one could administrate.

Pogo Pogo's picture

How long is the ban and why? My nephew was banned for 24 hours for excessive usage.

Pogo Pogo's picture

quote:


Originally posted by unionist:
[b]

1. The public broadcaster ought not to offer a platform to the "winner" of such a contest. If you like, start a "wish" to that effect.

2. No credibility should be given. If pro-choice forces participate and "lose", that's far worse than refusing to participate on principle.

3. If you think we can't afford to pass this up, then it never ends. We'll have to harass people to participate in, "I wish Preston Manning were Prime Minister", and "I wish Canada remains a capitalist country". No thank you.

4. "Making his case on CBC to the nation" is an oxymoron. The nation doesn't watch CBC. (j/k)

I think it's very wrong for progressive people to get sucked in to meaningless mob mania of this nature. I was unimpressed by the "greatest Canadian" madness. So Tommy Douglas won - wonderful - so what?

When they use these things to replace elections, I'll start worrying.[/b]


I agree. I think we should be using Facebook to organize our communities and build coalitions. Let the zealots fight over the fluff.

writer writer's picture

Her account has been disabled for about three days, I think.

remind remind's picture

quote:


Originally posted by Pogo:
[b]I agree. I think we should be using Facebook to organize our communities and build coalitions. Let the zealots fight over the fluff.[/b]

Excuse me, but having one's freedoms and rights put up for a wish to be gone is hardly fucking fluff, nor are we zealots because we wish to protect our Rights.

writer writer's picture

Just a quick mention that this thread is in the feminism forum. It would be so super nice if guys wouldn't keep coming here to shit on our very real concerns, calling them trivial.

And yeah, chances are that those who are involved in countering the CBC's current #1 wish to take away our self-determination might possibly be doing other things in the world for women's rights as well.

But thanks for the tip.

babblerwannabe

quote:


Originally posted by writer:
[b]Her account has been disabled for about three days, I think.[/b]

My account has been disabled for about 48 hours.

I understand why some people would not participate in this contest, but I think we are in the thick of it now and giving up would make us appear that we are really defeated. Someone decided to make a counter wish to keep Canada remain pro choice, why not support her?

While we shouldn’t care what people think, I don’t think that it is asking a lot for people to simply click a button and add support to the pro cho wish and invite their friends to our group.

I have thought about boycotting the contest as well, but , maybe I didn’t like the an extremist right wing group taking over a wish list, why can’t I do something about it? And why do people have to attack my efforts, if you don’t want to support it, than don’t but no need to be hostile to me. At least I am the one who is doing something, even if it's not alot, it's something that I have spent my time on.

And I wrote to facebook again. This is my third email to them. I have not received anything except a letter about how they will look into it. I do not feel good about this, but I will keep writing to them everyday.

There’s some nasty messages on my facebook group and I wish I could have deleted it. Obviously, they did not follow the fucking guidelines I wrote about respecting that my group is for pro choice supporters.

[ 18 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

writer writer's picture

Mid-afternoon, the gap between the anti-choice and pro-choice "wish" was 1,048. Now it's 806.

The pro-choice group on Facebook now has 2,160 members.

This group can continue after the contest, promoting access and other issues.

[url=http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2421536323]http://www.facebook.com...

Bacchus

You know, in reality, the contest is fluff, will stay fluff and disappear shortly after its finishing and they have some Anna Marie T discussion about who won. Doesnt matter its a short lived thing on the radar (if its even ON the radar of most canadians)

Ahh but the group that binds to fight it? That can and will last far far longer than this silly contest, with farther reaching consequences and a good foundation for activism in the future (bearing in mind Lagatta's point that the cyber grouping cannot substitute for real world activism but must complement it)

Unionist

quote:


Originally posted by Bacchus:
[b](bearing in mind Lagatta's point that the cyber grouping cannot substitute for real world activism but must complement it)[/b]

Someone's been forum shopping! [img]wink.gif" border="0[/img]

Bacchus

[img]wink.gif" border="0[/img] Thats what happens when I peruse the TAT first [img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img]

remind remind's picture

quote:


Originally posted by writer:
[b]Mid-afternoon, the gap between the anti-choice and pro-choice "wish" was 1,048. Now it's 806. [/b]

The difference is only 767 now.

[ 19 June 2007: Message edited by: remind ]

writer writer's picture

681!

remind remind's picture

681, wow with 11 days to go it is entirely do able, and plus somemore!

remind remind's picture

Apparently, Pro-Choice Canadian women on 2nd Life have taken this up as well, and are being quite active about it.

babblerwannabe

They are never giving me back my account. My 2000 + group has no admin and will never have an admin.
I will never give up. I will keep writing to them. Un-fucking-believable.

Here’s my exchange with Rose from facebook:

Hi Casey,

You have already been given multiple chances when we previously reactivated your account. You received numerous warnings to slow down. Failure to adhere to those warnings has resulted in the permanent loss of your account. We will not be able to reactivate your account for any reason. This decision is final.

Thank you for understanding,

Rose
Customer Support Representative
Facebook

My reply

Dear Rose:

My account was disabled twice. The first time, you guys sent me an email about how I am spamming, and that I should stop writing “form messages”. I was warned the second time, but I never did write any “form messages”, I did not spam and no one ever told me that posting too many messages too quickly is constructed to be *spamming* , there is no way to know what is considered *too many* or *too quickly" anyways.

Nevertheless, I *did* indeed stop posting (any) messages after I received the warning label. I waited for 12 hours after the warning label is
gone and than I started to post messages again, but than my account was disabled all together without any warning.

During the whole time , I was not spamming, I stopped posting when I got the warning and I did as you guys told. I did not *spam* , I also obeyed the warning, and now my account is disabled? Because I am following the rules? This
is quite unfair and I am appealing this decision and I am outraged.

Sincerely
Casey Yau

[ 19 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

[ 19 June 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]

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