45th President of the United States of America

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josh

SeekingAPoliticalHome wrote:

CNN Breaking

Muller laid charges, unknown charge, unknown who.  Grand jury approved? I dont know that much about mechanics.

Yes, the grand jury has apparently voted to indict person, or persons, yet unknown.  Flynn, Manafort among possibilities.

NorthReport

With all due respect it is going to be almost impossible to remove Trump from the WH for the following reasons:

He is not below firing Mueller and his orchestra has already started screeching about it.

He probably already has made a deal to pardon everyone who keeps their lips sealed and protects Trump and the rest of his cronies.

Trump controls the news with his tweets, and his fake news buddies at Fox, and the many other sick news outlets in the US

Trump media policies are expanding the fake news media outlets bigtime in the US, so soon the vast majority of Americans will be readily agreeing with fake news., and then rightwing freaks will be elected and control the political agenda forever.

 The Democrats might as well not even exist for all the opposition they put up and appear to be more focused on how they can keep Bernie from being their next presidential candidate. 

Mueller charges would shift the script for Trump

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/29/opinions/trump-mueller-outcomes-opinion-ze...

NorthReport
NorthReport
Sean in Ottawa

NorthReport wrote:

With all due respect it is going to be almost impossible to remove Trump from the WH for the following reasons:

He is not below firing Mueller and his orchestra has already started screeching about it.

He probably already has made a deal to pardon everyone who keeps their lips sealed and protects Trump and the rest of his cronies.

Trump controls the news with his tweets, and his fake news buddies at Fox, and the many other sick news outlets in the US

Trump media policies are expanding the fake news media outlets bigtime in the US, so soon the vast majority of Americans will be readily agreeing with fake news., and then rightwing freaks will be elected and control the political agenda forever.

 The Democrats might as well not even exist for all the opposition they put up and appear to be more focused on how they can keep Bernie from being their next presidential candidate. 

Mueller charges would shift the script for Trump

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/29/opinions/trump-mueller-outcomes-opinion-ze...

I disagree – you are ahead of the facts that will make a difference.

If there is no evidence against him personally, Trump is safe for now. If there is proven guilt though it is hard to imagine that his fingerprints would not be all over it. Trump is known to meddle directly.

This case is about the politics. Democrats are solid votes against him. The Republicans will back him like they did Richard Nixon -- until it is untenable to do so. The politics are not great for Trump. He is fighting too many battles at the same time:

1) Against the left and most non-white Americans

2) Against Republicans in more moderate districts worried about the political impact of his tax and health policies.

3) Against anyone supporting NAFTA -- including States that consider the deal essential for their economic position

4) Against anyone concerned about recklessly stumbling into war

5) Against anyone who considers the President should appear to have some decency and self-control

6) Against anyone who is concerned at the political damage to the Republicans long after he is gone

7) Against Republicans who are as extreme as Trump is (or more) but worry that he is ineffectual and incompetent

Now some of these are Republicans. The drip drip of concern here is adding up. Trump's support is not budging from the low levels it has been in -- and likely it is stuck there.

If there is no new evidence Republicans will pray (that's what they do) to be able to weather the storm. A significant revelation and they may cut their losses.

Trump is damaging the Republican party but they are hoping for a tax cut and won't throw him out unless he pooches that. If he cannot get tax reform through (and the Republicans cannot agree on what they like) he is in trouble. Trumps policy position is almost impossible -- no matter what he does he will make enough Republicans angry.

At the end of the day it is difficult to get rid of a President but this one is as weak as they come. The Republicans like his bluster but the party has little agreement on any action and too many who are already angry.

If Trump does not have a quiet time soon, he will run out of goodwill to burn on his side of the aisle.

voice of the damned

Yes, it is beyond hyperbole to say "the vast majority of Americans will be readily agreeing with fake news[ie. pro-Trump propaganda]". Ir is in fact pretty much the exact opposite of the situation.

Trump couldn't even win a plurality of the popular vote, and nothing he has done since the election would make his detractors like him any more than they did before.

I'd still say it's POSSIBLE that he could win re-election, but there would have to be a lot of other factors at play(yellow-dog Republican voters, absolutely awful Democratic candidate, US gets into a shooting war with North Korea just before the election etc), apart from just "Fox News tells everyone to vote for Trump and they all obey".

Cody87

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

I disagree – you are ahead of the facts that will make a difference.

If there is no evidence against him personally, Trump is safe for now. If there is proven guilt though it is hard to imagine that his fingerprints would not be all over it. Trump is known to meddle directly.

This case is about the politics. Democrats are solid votes against him. The Republicans will back him like they did Richard Nixon -- until it is untenable to do so. The politics are not great for Trump. He is fighting too many battles at the same time:

1) Against the left and most non-white Americans

2) Against Republicans in more moderate districts worried about the political impact of his tax and health policies.

3) Against anyone supporting NAFTA -- including States that consider the deal essential for their economic position

4) Against anyone concerned about recklessly stumbling into war

5) Against anyone who considers the President should appear to have some decency and self-control

6) Against anyone who is concerned at the political damage to the Republicans long after he is gone

7) Against Republicans who are as extreme as Trump is (or more) but worry that he is ineffectual and incompetent

Now some of these are Republicans. The drip drip of concern here is adding up. Trump's support is not budging from the low levels it has been in -- and likely it is stuck there.

If there is no new evidence Republicans will pray (that's what they do) to be able to weather the storm. A significant revelation and they may cut their losses.

Trump is damaging the Republican party but they are hoping for a tax cut and won't throw him out unless he pooches that. If he cannot get tax reform through (and the Republicans cannot agree on what they like) he is in trouble. Trumps policy position is almost impossible -- no matter what he does he will make enough Republicans angry.

At the end of the day it is difficult to get rid of a President but this one is as weak as they come. The Republicans like his bluster but the party has little agreement on any action and too many who are already angry.

If Trump does not have a quiet time soon, he will run out of goodwill to burn on his side of the aisle.

Please do not invest too much emotional energy into this narrative. Time and again Trump has exceeded expectations and every time he has done so despite claims essentially exactly the same as what you make above. He won't actually declare. Well he declared but it's just a PR stunt. Okay he's polling above the other republicans but he's just a blustering side-show, he won't actually win a single state when it comes down to voting. Okay, he won a state, but the voters will get tired of his antics soon. Alright, he won a few more states, but he'll drop out after super Tuesday. Well...he won't win the primary, the Republican establishment is unified against him. He got the most delegates, but with this loophole the RNC can nominate someone else - because he obviously can't win the presidency! #NeverTrump. Well, it doesn't matter that he's the nominee, he won't win the general - look at the polls! He won the general but he must have cheated we'll just do recounts! Okay his margin increased after the recounts but we can still flip electors in the electoral college. Okay he's president but he's gonna alienate his base and then he'll get impeached, just as soon as we find proof of Trump's business ties in Russia...

This is kind of like one of those cults where after their "doomsday" passes they double down on the next "doomsday"...

josh

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

Cody87 wrote:
Please do not invest too much emotional energy into this narrative.

This is almost the definition of concern trolling. "Don't start thinking that you may be correct, and I mistaken, because you'll only be emotionally crushed when I turn out to be totally right." It's annoying as hell.

Cody87 wrote:
Okay he's president but he's gonna alienate his base and then he'll get impeached, just as soon as we find proof of Trump's business ties in Russia...

Especially when your premises are so lacking in factual support.

I have posted at least a dozen links to serious articles describing in detail Trump's long term dependence on Russian money laundering to keep his business afloat. Here's a fairly recent example from The New Republic. It starts in 1984, when a 38 year old Russian immigrant named David Bogatin, who had no obvious source of great wealth, bought 5 units in the original Trump Tower, for about $6 million. It traces Trump's dependency on dirty Russian money from there, through the early 21st century deals with Felix Sater and Bayrock, at least up to 2010, when Sater was given his own Trump Organization business card, that read "FELIX H. SATER, SENIOR ADVISOR TO DONALD TRUMP".

None so blind as those who refuse to see.

voice of the damned

The idea that everyone underestimated Trump in 2016 is a little mis-stated. Yeah, not many people(myself included) predicted his victory, but throughout the campaign, his polling numbers often managed to get within striking distance of Hillary, occassionally even equaling or bettering hers. So his ultimate victory really wasn't some unforeseeable lightning strike, more like a contemporary rehash of Dewey Defeats Truman, or for an example from an era with more sophisticated polling techniques, Major Defeats Kinnock.  

These days, from what I'm taken to understand, Trump's poll numbers are much worse than they were during the campaign. Like I say, I think the GOP could still conceivably win with him on the ticket, but it would be in spite of, not because, of him.

voice of the damned

Another thing I think, and have possibly said before, is that it's better for the Democrats if Trump stays in office, because his continued presence in the White House damages the Republican brand. If he's impeached or resigns, Pence will likely adopt a "New Broom" posture, successfully distancing himself from the old administration. (This is a lot easier to do in the American system than in Westminister, where a new PM from the same party as the last one is still saddled with a lot of the old cabinet and all the old MPs.)

 

 

 

NorthReport

There’s only one way out of the Russia probe for Donald Trump before he’s forced to quit

The President will come to rely on his and Murdoch’s time-honoured capacity for steering credulous minds into a parallel world of altered perceptions, where truth is falsehood and falsehood truth

 

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/donald-trump-russia-investigation-pr...

josh

NorthReport wrote:

There’s only one way out of the Russia probe for Donald Trump before he’s forced to quit

The President will come to rely on his and Murdoch’s time-honoured capacity for steering credulous minds into a parallel world of altered perceptions, where truth is falsehood and falsehood truth

 

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/donald-trump-russia-investigation-pr...

Image result for goebbels accuse

 

NorthReport

Forget Paul Manafort – these are the men cooperating with the FBI who Trump should be really afraid of

Felix Sater is likely to be centre-stage if Trump’s downfall comes from his Russian monetary connections. Born Felix Sheferovsky in Russia, he is one of the most colourful characters in the Trump chronicles

 

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/paul-manafort-russia-donald-trump-fb...

NorthReport

So Trump is actually being investigated by the FBI according to what Trump's Chief of Staff Kelly said last nite on Fox News!

NorthReport

An Introduction To The Dark Arts Of Opposition Research

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/an-introduction-to-the-dark-arts-of...

Sean in Ottawa

It is strange that anyone thinks Trump is magical or even powerful. He is, in fact extremely weak. His power comes from powerful people who find him useful.

His run of doing what people thoguht he could do was simply a testament of how soiled these people would allow themselves to get to be able to use him.

As I have said he is no longer useful once either his tax reform passes or is proven to be impossible to pass, once he completes the wrecking of whatever he can of regulations and once his interference with business interests (through NAFTA) shows fewer dividends than benefits.

Powerful people have enough self control to have allies that are loyal. Powerful people are loyal to him only in so far as you can be loyal to a hammer.

His grass roots supporters are mostly stupid and have little influence over where this goes -- they just don't know that yet. The forces that brought him will take him out to the trash when they are done.

And another point -- they will want him to do a few things they can blame him for later when they pretend to oppose all that he has done that is unpopular.

NorthReport

The Civil War Was Not a Mistake

John Kelly’s account of its causes reflects a widely shared—and incorrect—understanding of the conflict.

Kelly’s remarks, then, are part of an American tradition of historical denial, and he is hardly its only adherent.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/10/dont-know-much-abou...

NorthReport

Upstairs at the White House, fuming with the TV on: How Donald Trump digested the Russia indictments

The president took the news of the first indictments with exasperation and disgust. He called his lawyers repeatedly. He listened intently to cable news commentary. With rising irritation, he watched live footage of his one-time campaign adviser turning himself in to the FBI.

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2017/10/31/upstairs-at-the-white-hous...

NorthReport

Why John Kelly’s remarks on Robert E. Lee, Civil War are ‘strange,’ ‘sad’ and ‘wrong’

White House Chief of Staff John Kelly made several points when he outlined his view of the history of the Civil War and called Robert E. Lee “an honourable man.” Historians weigh in on his remarks describing them as “strange,” “highly provocative,” “dangerous” and “kind of depressing.”

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2017/10/31/why-john-kellys-remarks-on...

NorthReport

The Myth of the Kindly General Lee

The legend of the Confederate leader’s heroism and decency is based in the fiction of a person who never existed.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/06/the-myth-of-the-kin...

NorthReport

The Broken Check and Balance

It’s up to Congress to police the executive—but so far, its Republican leaders are placing tribal loyalty ahead of their constitutional responsibility.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/10/republicans-in-cong...

NorthReport

Oh, my!

But Louise has been ahead of the curve all along this tragic road 

Mueller Has ‘Dozens’ of Sealed Indictments, Including On Donald Trump

https://patribotics.blog/2017/10/29/exclusive-mueller-has-dozens-of-seal...

 

NorthReport
NorthReport

 

NorthReport

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The remarkable thing is congressional Republicans have no idea what it is they're helping Trump cover up, and so no plans for what happens if it eventually comes out, and it's really bad:

NorthReport

FollowFollow @ezraklein

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The remarkable thing is congressional Republicans have no idea what it is they're helping Trump cover up, and so no plans for what happens if it eventually comes out, and it's really bad:

NorthReport
NorthReport
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    According to Don Jr it’s never too early to use your child as a political prop, or to steal candy from a baby.

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NorthReport

  56m56 minutes ago

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Adam Khan Retweeted Adam Khan

With Papadopolous, it’s not a question of whether there was a plan to engage Russia but who directed it, what Trump knew and when he knew it

Adam Khan added,

Adam Khan @Khanoisseur

Replying to @realDonaldTrump

Papadopoulos charges (he pleaded guilty): Trump campaign strategized sending someone “low level” to Russia “so as not to send any signal”

NorthReport

  Retweeted

  6h6 hours ago

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Act as a blatant cut-out for a known GRU front, then Western CI considers you a target of interest.

 

Sean in Ottawa

NorthReport wrote:

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The remarkable thing is congressional Republicans have no idea what it is they're helping Trump cover up, and so no plans for what happens if it eventually comes out, and it's really bad:

I think they don't care.

I think the strategy is to try to get an obscene tax proposal through, let Trump wear it politically, and then get rid of him. It is in their interest to let Trump survive for a few more months and get the nasty policies they want and then clean house (keeping the policies). This way the Republicans can bring in truly awful policies and still get re-elected.

 

It is somewhat risky but not more risky than any other strategy that would enact these policies.

NorthReport

Mueller schedules interview with Hope Hicks

The White House communications director is due to speak with prosecutors in the Russia probe after Trump returns from his Asia trip.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/31/mueller-russia-investigation-h...

NorthReport

Papadopoulos Charges With The Mystery Trump Camp Officials Filled In

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/these-are-trump-campaign-official...

NorthReport

Ukraine Believes Paul Manafort’s Crimes Go Way Beyond Money Laundering

Ukrainian investigators who helped collect evidence used to indict President Trump’s former campaign chairman also want to look at Manafort’s possible role in a 2014 massacre.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/ukraine-believes-paul-manaforts-crimes-go-...

NorthReport
NorthReport

That Crazy Talk About Robert Mueller

 

And then they came for Robert Mueller.

If there were any remaining hope that Republicans would accept the precise, methodical work of this veteran, highly respected, Republican-appointed law enforcement official — the man Newt Gingrich once called a “superb choice to be special counsel” — it has evaporated in a fog of propaganda and delirious conspiracy theories.

In the real world, Mr. Mueller, appointed as special counsel after President Trump fired the F.B.I. director, James Comey, in May, is doing the job he was hired to do — smoke out any and all links between the Trump campaign and the Russian government officials who assaulted American sovereignty in 2016 in an effort to get Mr. Trump elected. These days, the most serious attacks on American governance are coming not from abroad, but from Mr. Trump’s aides and his allies in the right-wing media and Congress. As ludicrous as these attacks seem, they could yet lead to a constitutional crisis.

Reading the increasingly outlandish theories cooked up by Mr. Trump’s defenders and apologists is like entering an alternate, upside-down universe where Hillary Clinton remains Public Enemy No. 1.

In these irrelevant tales, Mrs. Clinton (or, as Sean Hannity called her on Monday, “President Clinton”) is the real colluder, working stealthily with the Russians to — stay with us here — destroy her own candidacy. Also, she and Bill Clinton once sold American uranium to the Russians. Also, Robert Mueller failed to fully investigate that sale when he led the F.B.I., so he’s complicit in it, too, not to mention he has ties to Mr. Comey, who also led the F.B.I. Also, some of his investigators donated to Democratic candidates.

There’s no bottom to the delusion on display. At this point, investigators could release videotapes of Vladimir Putin personally handing Mr. Trump a uranium-lined briefcase filled with stolen emails, and the right-wing armada would find a way to blame Mrs. Clinton. (This would be followed, of course, by a congressional investigation to identify who leaked the tapes.)

 

These efforts at obfuscation and misdirection would be laughable, but they are linked to a very real and dangerous move by Trump allies throughout right-wing media and the government to shut down the Russia investigation for good.

It’s no secret that Mr. Trump has been itching to get rid of Mr. Mueller since soon after his appointment as special counsel in May. Mr. Trump’s advisers have told him that would be a terrible idea and have reportedly talked him out of it more than once. But the calls for such a move are now coming from some of the most influential voices in conservative media, as are other equally bad proposals, like urging that Mr. Mueller resign and that Mr. Trump pardon anyone and everyone caught up in the Russia investigation — including himself.

Mr. Trump would be wise to continue to ignore these loony ideas and restrain his own authoritarian reflexes. The president of the United States, no less than any citizen, lives under the law, not above it; Mr. Mueller’s investigation is the embodiment of that fact. Removing him now, after he has already secured two indictments, including one for Mr. Trump’s former campaign chief, and a guilty plea by a foreign-policy adviser, would send the message that Mr. Trump and his aides are accountable to no one.

Over the last several weeks, a few top Republicans have found the courage to say out loud what a majority of Americans have known for a long time: With his erratic behavior and antidemocratic eruptions, Donald Trump is presenting a profound danger to security of the nation and the stability of the world order. So far, these dissidents have beat their chests in a safe space, giving eloquent speeches on their way out the door.

But it will not be hard for them to turn their words into actions if Mr. Trump gives in to an impulse to fire Mr. Mueller. Do the math: Three Republican senators (looking at you, Mr. McCain, Mr. Corker and Mr. Flake), joining with 48 Democrats, could bring the Senate to a halt until Mr. Mueller was reinstated — no tax cuts, no more judges confirmed.

The scenario in which Mr. Mueller loses his job, or Mr. Trump further abuses his pardon power, is hypothetical — and may it remain so — but if it materializes, it will fall to Congress to defend the foundations of American democracy, the separation of powers and the rule of law.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/31/opinion/that-crazy-talk-about-robert-...

 

Cody87

Michael Moriarity wrote:

Cody87 wrote:
Please do not invest too much emotional energy into this narrative.

This is almost the definition of concern trolling. "Don't start thinking that you may be correct, and I mistaken, because you'll only be emotionally crushed when I turn out to be totally right." It's annoying as hell.

Correct me where I'm wrong. Literally every argument that Sean made (establishment repubs hate him, his base will get sick of him, he's just an idiot, etc) has been made over and over during the last 30 months, and every time those predictions were wrong and spectacularly so. Not just wrong but the complete opposite of what actually happened. What's the difference this time? I expect the same results as the last dozen times these predictions were made, so I'm a concern troll?

85% of water speed record attempts are fatal. If you know someone who's going to attempt to break the water speed record, and you tell them if they try they will probably not break the record and also die, that's not concern trolling, that's just a common sense conclusion based on the data. If someone says that Trump's base is going to get sick of his antics, or Trump needs the help of the #NeverTrump Republicans, or whatever, they're not paying attention to the data which unanimously suggests that's not the case and has never been the case.

Quote:
Cody87 wrote:
Okay he's president but he's gonna alienate his base and then he'll get impeached, just as soon as we find proof of Trump's business ties in Russia...

Especially when your premises are so lacking in factual support.

I have posted at least a dozen links to serious articles describing in detail Trump's long term dependence on Russian money laundering to keep his business afloat. Here's a fairly recent example from The New Republic. It starts in 1984, when a 38 year old Russian immigrant named David Bogatin, who had no obvious source of great wealth, bought 5 units in the original Trump Tower, for about $6 million. It traces Trump's dependency on dirty Russian money from there, through the early 21st century deals with Felix Sater and Bayrock, at least up to 2010, when Sater was given his own Trump Organization business card, that read "FELIX H. SATER, SENIOR ADVISOR TO DONALD TRUMP".

None so blind as those who refuse to see.

That's kind of proving my broader point. If your case against Trump is so strong, and we can assume his political opponents with their billion dollar campaigns are aware of said case, and he's still not impeached, then what makes you think he's gonna get impeached any day now?

Cody87

josh wrote:

Image result for goebbels accuse

I literally laughed out loud when I saw this. Trump's supporters have been circulating this since Clinton started accusing Trump of colluding with Russia last year. Poetic that it's now being used against him.

Cody87

voice of the damned wrote:

The idea that everyone underestimated Trump in 2016 is a little mis-stated. Yeah, not many people(myself included) predicted his victory, but throughout the campaign, his polling numbers often managed to get within striking distance of Hillary, occassionally even equaling or bettering hers. So his ultimate victory really wasn't some unforeseeable lightning strike, more like a contemporary rehash of Dewey Defeats Truman, or for an example from an era with more sophisticated polling techniques, Major Defeats Kinnock. 

Historical revisionism at it's finest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KSdAjsXbpk

Rachel Maddow did a good bit on this "even if Trump won every toss up, and nobody ever wins every toss up, he would still lose" as well.

Quote:
These days, from what I'm taken to understand, Trump's poll numbers are much worse than they were during the campaign. Like I say, I think the GOP could still conceivably win with him on the ticket, but it would be in spite of, not because, of him.

Yeah, his poll numbers are like the worst we've ever seen. And at the same time, the stock market is at an all time high, house prices are at an all time high, consumer confidence is at a 20 year high, business investment is way up, and everyone who relies on public support and challenges Trump is getting destroyed. Just look at Hollywood box office openings, or Jeff Flake, or the acceleration in the NFL's dip in ratings. Meanwhile anti-Trump news sources are suffering huge declines in ratings and the pro-Trump alternative media (and Hannity+Tucker) are seeing huge growth.

Obviously, all of these things are happening because Trump is SO unpopular.  /s

This thread is giving me flashbacks to last October, good god. Don't trust the polls, use your eyes.

josh

You are confusing attention with popularity.

josh

NorthReport wrote:

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    According to Don Jr it’s never too early to use your child as a political prop, or to steal candy from a baby.

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Have to say Bill Kristol, of all people, may have had the best retort:

https://twitter.com/BillKristol/status/925509380891664385

voice of the damned

the acceleration in the NFL's dip in ratings

Assuming that this dip is entirely due to people outraged about "taking a knee"...

How many of those outraged viewers are Democrats or non-voters who are now thinking of switiching over to Trump, or going back to active-voter status in order to support Trump, because of the anthem issue? Because long-time Republicans boycotting the NFL don't indicate any electoral movement.

Same with the ratings for right-wing talk shows. You think there are really a lot of Hillary voters from 2016 who are saying "Well, I didn't like Trump last year, but he's really impressed me since taking office, and now I'm so fired up for him I'm gonna start tuning in to Hannity and Tucker to cheer on my new political heroes"?

More likely, most of the increase in Hannity and Tucker's following is coming from the long-converted, who are being drawn into right-wing media by the rejuvenated attention surrounding Trump, and, to a lesser extent, people who have no intention of switching to him, but just want to see what the relevant media are saying.

And in this day and age, it's quite easy for websites to get traffic from their political opponents, via linkage from not neccessarily friendly sites, eg. Slate.com publishing  summaries about the latest right-wing media outrages, with links to the sites in question. 

You're on firmer ground talking about the economy. Yeah, that's something that, combined with the idiosyncraices of the Electoral College, could help Trump, especially if there is perceived growth in the Rust Belt states that pushed him over the top last time. (I'm skeptical about that, but we'll see.)

 

bekayne

Cody87 wrote:

Meanwhile anti-Trump news sources are suffering huge declines in ratings and the pro-Trump alternative media (and Hannity+Tucker) are seeing huge growth.

 

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2017/1101/916772-new-york-times-reports...

https://www.google.ca/search?q=Breitbart+losing+money&rlz=1C1CHWA_enCA62...

There was a chart I saw a couple of days ago showing how much "winning" Breitbart is doing lately, I'll try to find it.

Sean in Ottawa

Cody87 wrote:

Michael Moriarity wrote:

Cody87 wrote:
Please do not invest too much emotional energy into this narrative.

This is almost the definition of concern trolling. "Don't start thinking that you may be correct, and I mistaken, because you'll only be emotionally crushed when I turn out to be totally right." It's annoying as hell.

Correct me where I'm wrong. Literally every argument that Sean made (establishment repubs hate him, his base will get sick of him, he's just an idiot, etc) has been made over and over during the last 30 months, and every time those predictions were wrong and spectacularly so. Not just wrong but the complete opposite of what actually happened. What's the difference this time? I expect the same results as the last dozen times these predictions were made, so I'm a concern troll?

85% of water speed record attempts are fatal. If you know someone who's going to attempt to break the water speed record, and you tell them if they try they will probably not break the record and also die, that's not concern trolling, that's just a common sense conclusion based on the data. If someone says that Trump's base is going to get sick of his antics, or Trump needs the help of the #NeverTrump Republicans, or whatever, they're not paying attention to the data which unanimously suggests that's not the case and has never been the case.

Quote:
Cody87 wrote:
Okay he's president but he's gonna alienate his base and then he'll get impeached, just as soon as we find proof of Trump's business ties in Russia...

Especially when your premises are so lacking in factual support.

I have posted at least a dozen links to serious articles describing in detail Trump's long term dependence on Russian money laundering to keep his business afloat. Here's a fairly recent example from The New Republic. It starts in 1984, when a 38 year old Russian immigrant named David Bogatin, who had no obvious source of great wealth, bought 5 units in the original Trump Tower, for about $6 million. It traces Trump's dependency on dirty Russian money from there, through the early 21st century deals with Felix Sater and Bayrock, at least up to 2010, when Sater was given his own Trump Organization business card, that read "FELIX H. SATER, SENIOR ADVISOR TO DONALD TRUMP".

None so blind as those who refuse to see.

That's kind of proving my broader point. If your case against Trump is so strong, and we can assume his political opponents with their billion dollar campaigns are aware of said case, and he's still not impeached, then what makes you think he's gonna get impeached any day now?

Cody you need to let go of your straw man here. You missed the whole point of what I was saying. Perhaps you could slow down reread and take the time to look at complete posts.

You also are listing points that I have never made (I did not say his base would tire of him-- the republican party is not his base).

What I did say is this:

Trump is weak. He is there not because he is strong but becuase he is useful.

All the weaknesses I mention are real but so is his utility. History has not proven strength becuase his endurance is there for other reasons.

I said certain Republicans will stand by him until they have what they want from him -- a tax policy that they do not want their names on. They will use him to bring in what no intelligent politician would want to be associated with. When they get rid of him they will attach those things (that they wanted him to do) to his reputation instead of their own. They supported him in the past, the present and for a while in the future, in order to get what they want and to have him go with the smoking gun. Once he is no longer useful he will fold as the weak president that he is.

People are looking at the wrong hand here. Trump is not the master conman -- the Republican party is. They want Trump to do some terrible things and they want him to fail and go away once it is done so they can wash their hands.

Now others may say this but it is not the prevailing opinion.  Most take the view that he is already screwed (I don't he is still useful) or that he is strong and crazy like a fox and is unbeatable. Both are wrong. He is not the story and his attempts to be the story are in themselves useful. The story is the Republican party have created a kleenex president they can blow their snot into and then remove.

US citizens need to watch the things they are losing the policies rather than the person who is not the real story here.

Republicans want you to think Trump is Putin's useful idiot so people do not see whose idiot he really is and why he is there.

NorthReport
SeekingAPolitic...

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/11/the-west-wing-trump-is-apoplecti...

According to this article, Bannon is back. Cabinet has the power vote out the president. Bannon told trump that if the vote happens it may go against trump.  Kashiner is being blamed for the problems and Bannon wants his head.  

NorthReport

!!

Sean in Ottawa

The big disappointment will come afterwards.

He is not the source of racism and the fact that he got to where he is proves just how significant that is at the level of power in the US.

His wacky beliefs are widely held.

His influence is greater than he is -- the judges he leaves behind, the damage to government policy, the division he created.

The US is sick and crazy. Trump is not that sickness -- he just exposed it.

The Republican party is all kinds of crazy -- some kinds of Trump crazy and some other kindes that are no better.

The US prefers not to show what it is all about but with Trump you get to see it.

NorthReport

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