Canadian Peace Congress Convention 2018

24 posts / 0 new
Last post
Future_is_Socialism
Canadian Peace Congress Convention 2018

CANADIAN PEACE CONGRESS TO HOLD ITS CONVENTION ON NOVEMBER 24-25, 2018 IN TORONTO!

Saturday Session - Steelworkers Hall, 25 Cecil St., Toronto 9:00 am - 4:00  pm. General admission - $10.00
 

Dear Friends,

We are very pleased to inform you that the Canadian Peace Congress will convene its 2018 Convention on November 24-25, 2018 in Toronto, and we extend an open invitation to all our friends and supporters, and all those concerned war, peace, and the fate of our planet to join us!

Our Convention comes at a critical, dangerous moment. The world, as we all know, is becoming an increasingly scary place. While aggression and war are nothing new, the rapid deterioration in international relations, increasing tensions, and the announced intentions of the Trump Administration to launch a whole new round of the arms race are alarming developments indeed.

Imperialist wars of aggression on Syria and Yemen continue to rage. Despite international condemnation, Israel is tightening its siege of Gaza and its advancing its annexationist plans for the whole of the Occupied Palestinian Territories. 'Regime change' operations against Venezuela, Nicaragua and other progressive governments are intensifying.

The hopeful signs of a peaceful resolution to the conflict on the Korean peninsula are being threatened by ultra-right hawks in Washington and the forces of the military-industrial complex.

At the international level, the active cultivation of Russo-phobia and Sino-phobia is creating a chilling 'cold war' atmosphere which the world has not experienced for decades. Add to this the U.S. decision to cancel the Iran nuclear deal (JCPOA), the INF Treaty, and its threat to cancel new START treaty talks to reduce nuclear arsenals.

The organized advance of racist, national chauvinist, and neo-fascist movements in many countries; the deepening economic crisis of capitalism on a system-wide level (reflected in increasing rivalries, trade/tariff wars, and predictions of another global meltdown); and the ever-more intense impact of the crisis of climate change -- all these dangerous and inter-related phenomena are like destructive 'weather systems' that are swirling and converging into a 'super storm' which threatens the very future of humanity!

And what role is the Trudeau Government in Ottawa playing in all of this? Is it an active force for peace and disarmament? Hardly! In fact, Ottawa has become one of the most bellicose voices promoting the drive to militarism, aggression and war.

Unfortunately, the peace forces across Canada are too few, too divided, and in some cases too disoriented by imperialist propaganda and fear-mongering to respond to the growing danger, and to turn Canadian foreign policy in the direction of peace and disarmament. Rebuilding, re-focusing, and uniting the peace movement across Canada for all those devoting to stopping and reversing this perilous drift to calamity.

It is our hope that the Canadian Peace Congress can and will play a much more enhanced role in building up and uniting the voices for peace. For us, this is our most urgent and compelling task.

We take this opportunity to invite you to join with us in constructive discussion on how best to rebuild and strengthen our peace movement, and advance our common struggle against imperialist aggression and war!

________________

Our featured speakers

Bahman Azad is an Iranian-American activist and the Organizational Secretary of the U.S. Peace Council. He also serves on the Secretariat of the World Peace Council.

Eva Bartlett is a prominent Canadian independent journalist and activist working in solidarity with the Palestinian people’s struggle, and in opposing the imperialist-orchestrated and financed ‘proxy’ war on Syria.

Christopher Black is a Canadian-based international criminal lawyer, writer and blogger. He is an outspoken critic of U.S. and Canadian foreign policies which contribute to heightening international tensions and the growing danger of nuclear war.

Miguel Figueroa is the Acting President of the Canadian Peace Congress. He is a long-time social and political activist, and served for 23 years as the leader of the Communist Party of Canada (1993-2016).

Tamara Lorincz is an Executive member of the Canadian Voice of Women and an active peace campaigner, focusing on the rise of militarism and its connection to environmental catastrophe.

Grand Chief Stewart Phillip is an Okanagan Aboriginal leader and the Grand Chief (President) of the Union of BC Indian Chiefs since 1998. He has played a leading role in the environmental struggle to oppose the Kinder Morgan pipeline, and around many other indigenous issues.

Adrien Welsh is a prominent Canadian youth leader, based in Montreal. He is the general-secretary of the Young Communist League, and an activist in the Mouvement Québécois pour la Paix.

 

montgomery

You say that the future is Socialism. I say the future is "Socially responsible Capitalism". 

Are the two the same? I think they are and my title fits better that which I see as the future of the NDP. Indeed, the future of our country!

Now I invite you to talk about how Canada's capitalist system needs to differ from the US system which I like to describe and Greedy and socially irresponsible capitalism. Is that a topic of interest for you? Or am I off-topic and not talking in a way that is condusive to your movement's agenda?

NDPP

The Jimmy Dore Show

https://youtu.be/qT1JAzhywfA

Marxist economic theory easily explained w/Richard Wolff

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

montgomery wrote:

You say that the future is Socialism. I say the future is "Socially responsible Capitalism".

I do not think the way forward is through an oxymoron. The current global capitalists are the imperialists who the peace movement wants to oppose. So what does your comment have to so with building an anti-war coalition or this specific Peace Conference? If you have some good ideas about how the Western oligarchies can be made to stop their wars of aggression that would be appreciated.

montgomery

NDPP wrote:

The Jimmy Dore Show

https://youtu.be/qT1JAzhywfA

Marxist economic theory easily explained w/Richard Wolff

I'm going to assume that your post was an answer for me. Sorry if I'm wrong. I'm quite familiar with Richard Wolff but I watched your link to see if you were making a point on something he's saying that I needed to know. No, there wasn't anything new to me.

So not understanding the point you want to get across with that link, I'll have to introduce my own point out of what Wolff had to say.

He seems to have some reservations on Denmark's and Norway's systems of government but he's not being very specific on spelling it out. I'm not all that sure about what Wolff envisions as the answer? But I will say that if he can't accept the term, 'socially responsible capitalism', then he's not talking my language.

Maybe a better reference would have been to Chris Hedges? 

Were you trying to make a point by offering a link to Wolff's ideas? What's your point which I seem to be missing?

Unionist

Could have sworn the "Canadian Peace Congress", which was sort of an old-style vehicle for the pro-Soviet communist party, disbanded decades ago. Live and learn! And is it different from the Canadian Peace Alliance? So many groups, so little time...

NDPP

"Capitalism is busted and can't be fixed." - Wolff-

montgomery

kropotkin1951 wrote:

montgomery wrote:

If it's 'socially responsible capitalism' you are referring to as an oxymoron, you're wrong and it's not. It's working very well in the happiest countries of the world, of which Canada does hold a place. 7th. I think but far from the Scandinavian countries that lead the pack, and aslo far from US style greedy and socially irresponsible capitalism.

You say that the future is Socialism. I say the future is "Socially responsible Capitalism".

I do not think the way forward is through an oxymoron. The current global capitalists are the imperialists who the peace movement wants to oppose. So what does your comment have to so with building an anti-war coalition or this specific Peace Conference? If you have some good ideas about how the Western oligarchies can be made to stop their wars of aggression that would be appreciated.

montgomery

Sorry for the mixed up quotes. I'm still trying to figure out this board's format.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

As long as you count imperial nations then you have winners in those countries and considerably more humans in other parts of the globe who suffer from the global capitalists pillaging on behalf of European.  Its easy to be happy when you get everyone else's stuff in exchange for providing NATO with the tools to get the job done.

WWWTT

Hi montgomery. I think you probably should start your own thread under the right heading. To me it sounds like you want to discuss something but can’t find the right existing thread so you’re square pegging your views into it. For me this makes it hard to engage. Unless that’s your point? Are you afraid?

montgomery

WWWTT wrote:

Hi montgomery. I think you probably should start your own thread under the right heading. To me it sounds like you want to discuss something but can’t find the right existing thread so you’re square pegging your views into it. For me this makes it hard to engage. Unless that’s your point? Are you afraid?

I think I'm right on topic here. Maybe an explanation will help? Nowhere in the world is there an example of pure socialism or pure capitalism; there are only varying degrees of each. I would consider the US brand of capitalism to be one of the most extreme and egregious examples. 

But I don't know of any example of pure socialism in the world today. All are capitalist to some degree, excepting perhaps some small country primitive examples I'm not aware of? Perhaps you and/or others can provide such example?

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GGGE_enCA448CA448&q=happiest+Canada...

(I hope I've posted the link corrctly, I'm not familiar with the format here yet)

And I've posted that link to provide examples of what I consider the best examples of 'socially responsible capitalism' in the world today. Can anyone produce a better alternative?

Having said that, I totally concur with sentiments directed against Nato and Canada's participation in it. I consider Nato nothing more than a tool of US aggression and serving no purpose other than that. There's just too much water under the bridge now to be fooled into thinking otherwise. That being, 40 US wars of aggression since WW2 alone! 

None of the happiest countries in the world are examples of perfection, but I'm very interested in hearing of an existing model that can serve better. 

Maybe I should also say that I see in post #6 a commenter who discounts the notion of a"Canadian Peace Congress" altogether! Personally, I don't think it hurts to be somewhat more tolerant of the notion, fwiw. They may actually have a model country's system to promote?

montgomery

kropotkin1951 wrote:

As long as you count imperial nations then you have winners in those countries and considerably more humans in other parts of the globe who suffer from the global capitalists pillaging on behalf of European.  Its easy to be happy when you get everyone else's stuff in exchange for providing NATO with the tools to get the job done.

If you criticize that which I'm promoting Kropotkin, then I would expect you can provide examples of something better. If none of the 10 happiest countries in the world meet your priorities then I'm of the opinion that our job is to promote something better for Canada which still lies within the description of 'capitalism'. My contribution for a start would be: A happy country without Nato! 

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

montgomery wrote:

kropotkin1951 wrote:

As long as you count imperial nations then you have winners in those countries and considerably more humans in other parts of the globe who suffer from the global capitalists pillaging on behalf of European.  Its easy to be happy when you get everyone else's stuff in exchange for providing NATO with the tools to get the job done.

If you criticize that which I'm promoting Kropotkin, then I would expect you can provide examples of something better. If none of the 10 happiest countries in the world meet your priorities then I'm of the opinion that our job is to promote something better for Canada which still lies within the description of 'capitalism'. My contribution for a start would be: A happy country without Nato! 

montgomery, I respect your intentions, and yes, a revival of the New Deal form of capitalism, or what has also been called "the accord"-the post-1945 US/UK/Canada/"Western Europe" arrangement in which high wages, full employment, decent employee benefits and job security for working people(well, in the US, for white, male working people, to be accurate) were guaranteed by employers in exchange for labor peace-would be a significant material improvement in the lives of the many.  The problem is, the wealthy, the 1%, in all countries no longer feel that they need to offer that kind of guarantee-the possibility that Communism(flawed and excessively repressive as it was in practice) might bring them down no longer exists.  At this point, a new, better alternative has no yet emerged as a direct threat to their power.  So would you not agree, montgomery, that, to get something like you are working for, that we need the creation of a radical alternative to the status quo,  an alternative potent enough to pose a real threat to the existing order, needs to be built?

montgomery

montgomery wrote:

kropotkin1951 wrote:

As long as you count imperial nations then you have winners in those countries and considerably more humans in other parts of the globe who suffer from the global capitalists pillaging on behalf of European.  Its easy to be happy when you get everyone else's stuff in exchange for providing NATO with the tools to get the job done.

If you criticize that which I'm promoting Kropotkin, then I would expect you can provide examples of something better. If none of the 10 happiest countries in the world meet your priorities then I'm of the opinion that our job is to promote something better for Canada which still lies within the description of 'capitalism'. My contribution for a start would be: A happy country without Nato! 

And so Kropotkin, it appears that your socialist country is only in your mind. 

And I'll just add that the NDP or the CCF before them, never acted as, or promoted pure socialism. It's always been an agenda of socially responsible capitalism that has worked in Canada's NDP opposition when it has become the official opposition or in any NDP provincial government. 

I would suggest that your label of 'socialist' for good government is not based on the reality of past experience anywhere in the world. You're imagining something that hasn't ever existed but that's an acceptable position to take in my opinion if you can tell us just what you are imagining? And if you can't then you haven't thought it through to some workable conclusions.

You hint  about the miserable lot of people in countries that suffer under the demands and excesses of capitalism, and I have a great deal of sentiments for their plight. But you're short on answers

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Your answer is the status quo with a minor tweak. I tend to think in terms of people like J.S. Woodsworth; "What we desire for ourselves, we wish for all." Apparently your "all" only refers to humans in NATO imperialist countries. I on the other hand would like to include all humans not just those under the military umbrella of the countries that spend the most on arms to dominate the world.

montgomery

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Your answer is the status quo with a minor tweak. I tend to think in terms of people like J.S. Woodsworth; "What we desire for ourselves, we wish for all." Apparently your "all" only refers to humans in NATO imperialist countries. I on the other hand would like to include all humans not just those under the military umbrella of the countries that spend the most on arms to dominate the world.

Apparently you didn't read what I said:

Quote:
You hint  about the miserable lot of people in countries that suffer under the demands and excesses of capitalism, and I have a great deal of sentiments for their plight. But you're short on answers.

If you had you wouldn't have made that  accusation.

Let me know when you have some ideas to share on the kind of socialism you seem to think you're envisioning. I 'do' have some answers for you on what I envision for Canada and which is called 'socially responsible capitalism'. Where should I start? How about Norway's prison system. If you're not aware of how it works, you can find out and I'll consider that a good start. That is, considering you don't have any ideas of your own you want to share with me.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Montogomery you are right I don't have all the answers. Your breath of understanding of the subject matter so far exceeds mine I will leave it all to you. I am in awe.

montgomery

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Montogomery you are right I don't have all the answers. Your breath of understanding of the subject matter so far exceeds mine I will leave it all to you. I am in awe.

Please Kropotkin, I have never suggested that you should have all the answers. But I gave you an example of 'socially responsible capitalism' which I had hoped you would be interested in learning about. Norway's prison system can't be referred to as 'socialism' because it in no way fits the definition. It does however fit the definition of 'socially responsible capitalism' quite nicely.

Nobody is expected to have all the answers. Rather, I suggested that you don't have any answers. And yes, you should take a break from this topic until you are prepared to provide some explanations of what you envision as 'socialism'!

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Montogomery who the fuck do you think you are? This thread is about a Peace Conference and you are demanding I give you a PHD level post on socialism. Fuck off.

montgomery

In my opinion it's an excellent article that doesn't miss any of the critical talking points. But then comes the difficult question: 

From the article:

Quote:
We take this opportunity to invite you to join with us in constructive discussion on how best to rebuild and strengthen our peace movement, and advance our common struggle against imperialist aggression and war!

Which I can only answer with another question or two: Does any political party have the courage to move us away from US blackmail demands by diversifying our trade relations elsewhere? Will any party speak out against US aggression throughout the world. Does any party have the courage to follow suit with the growing discontent over Nato being not much more than a tool of the US to legitimize their wars.

And most important: Would any party that tried to do any of the above, survive the backlash from the Canadian people who are thoroughly propagandized into support of the US while condemning China/Russia/ Putin/Xi?

Is it now time to start taking a stand? Can there ever be a better time to oppose the US, now that they have a madman at the helm who can be safely criticized?

There's little credibility in criticizing Trudeau for not doing that which the NDP party is afraid to do itself. 

So here's an honest question: Has the NDP gone out on any limbs against the US and it's aggression. And if there's a positive answer, then maybe this would be a good place to talk it up?

I'm going to make a wild assumption that this board has an audience who would appreciate hearing it!

To reply to Ken Burch's comment from post #14:

Quote:
 So would you not agree, montgomery, that, to get something like you are working for, that we need the creation of a radical alternative to the status quo,  an alternative potent enough to pose a real threat to the existing order, needs to be built?

Yes I do Ken, and that's what I'm attempting to explore here. And again I ask, is socialism and socially responsible capitalism one and the same thing. I suggest that it is and if it isn't then somebody please try to point out and demonstrate the differences. 

Pure capitalism and pure socialism don't exist in any countries of the world that I'm aware of.  The US is in my opinion striving to create a pure capitalist system which could result in another world war. And the closest I can visualize as pure socialism is likely anarchy in some African tribal community. 

The article by the Canadian Peace Congress is brilliant and hits all the talking points. Can't we expand on that and put their efforts to good use?

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

montgomery wrote:

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Montogomery you are right I don't have all the answers. Your breath of understanding of the subject matter so far exceeds mine I will leave it all to you. I am in awe.

Please Kropotkin, I have never suggested that you should have all the answers. But I gave you an example of 'socially responsible capitalism' which I had hoped you would be interested in learning about. Norway's prison system can't be referred to as 'socialism' because it in no way fits the definition. It does however fit the definition of 'socially responsible capitalism' quite nicely.

Nobody is expected to have all the answers. Rather, I suggested that you don't have any answers. And yes, you should take a break from this topic until you are prepared to provide some explanations of what you envision as 'socialism'!

The problem is that this is not a thread you opened up to discuss socially responsible capitalism. This thread is about a Peace Conference. I quoted the most famous pacifist CCF'er because he represents the very old view that without peace there can be no social justice.

I don't really care whether you like the Norwegian prison system because frankly it is irrelevant to peace on this planet. So to me our interaction was more like you telling me that you believe in unicorns (socially responsible capitalism) and me saying but we are actually talking about horses in this thread. Then you proceed to demand that I talk about how horses compare to unicorns. Why not start a thread about the Norwegian prison system where you lay out YOUR views instead of pretending your Socrates and asking a series of questions.

WWWTT

Hi Kropotkin. I'm not engaging montgomery in this thread because he posted a link that's all about this:

Canada is the 7th happiest country in the world, according to World Happiness Index

I myself find the term "world hapiness index" to be total stupid fuckin bullshit not worth a second more of my time! Kropotkin, do you think that the "world hapiness index" is something that you would use?

montgomery

WWWTT wrote:

Hi Kropotkin. I'm not engaging montgomery in this thread because he posted a link that's all about this:

Canada is the 7th happiest country in the world, according to World Happiness Index

I myself find the term "world hapiness index" to be total stupid fuckin bullshit not worth a second more of my time! Kropotkin, do you think that the "world hapiness index" is something that you would use?

Here's a quote from the site that tells us what they see as that which makes those countries the happiest in the world:

Quote:
The top countries frequently have high values for all six of the key variables that contribute to overall well-being: income (GDP per capita), healthy life expectancy, social support, freedom, trust (absence of corruption) and generosity.

And so fellow socialists (using the term loosely), don't those 'key variable' explain our NDP agenda to a T? Is there anything missing? I would suggest that the only thing that could be missing i the degree to which those values are adhered to by government.

And that's where the key comes in for our discussion on socialism and degrees of socialist policy for our country. No country will ever be pure socialist and that includes Finland which leads the pack. No would be a good time to explore and learn how we can emulate Finland and take it's place as #1.

And for contrast, those who aren't aware of what is happening to capitalism in the US should take some time to learn about it. You will see from the article I posted that they are slipping down the list of the happiest countries rapidly and now sit in 18th. place.

If nothing else, take some time from pulling the wings off of houseflies and tell us how we can add to the list of qualities that go to making a happier and more socially responsible country!

A fwiw, how about maybe thinking of how we can gain more acceptance with the people of Canada by changing the label of what we all strive for? I personally like the label,  'socially responsible capitalism' but we can refine it to what will work best. Nobody but us need know that we're striving for the top of the list, which quite quite remarkably describes the most 'socialist' leaning country in the world.

Because you see folks, the alternative is to just continue with the houseflies, which sadly describes this forum now doesn't it!

Kropotkin says:

Quote:
Montogomery who the fuck do you think you are? This thread is about a Peace Conference and you are demanding I give you a PHD level post on socialism. Fuck off.