Bruce-Grey-Owen Sound MPP Bill Murdoch says it's time Toronto separates from the rest of Ontario.

Has anyone asked Hudak to comment on this or if he plans any disciplinary action against Murdoch?

Gotta give Toronto one thing, they don't elect many Cons. 

Too many Liberanos perhaps but hey, you lefties should look at bagkitty.  [nyah] 

I think its a great idea. Toronto has certain needs (i.e. public transit, social housing) which, while not unique, are qualitatively different than most of the rest of the province because of how big and densely populated Toronto is.  Provincial status would give Toronto the taxing power (income, sales) to pay for these things, or to negotiate directly with the federal government for appropriate transfer payments. Personally rather than just making Toronto a separate province I'd prefer if some more general quasi-provincial "city state" status could be created under the Constitution, which could then potentially be offered to the National Capital Region, Vancouver and/or Montreal if they want it, too.

EDITED TO ADD: The toll booths comment above appears to have been added in jest, but I actually think something like that would make a lot of sense, too, in order to ensure that commuters who work in Toronto but live in the suburbs still pay their fare share for city roads and services and the like.

Great idea Webgear.... until the inevitable nyah bomb race starts.

Personally I am holding out for a reestablishment of the divine right of [s]bagkittys[/s] kings... and if that ever happens, expulsion will be the the least of Toronto's worries.

Perhaps Murdoch is using a bit of tongue-in-cheekiness to pry some discussion out of the people's elected officials, and the departments that govern the province.  He should have possibly stuck with making fun of Toronto's wind turbine and suggesting legislation to pop the things up in any un-used urban spaces in the GTA.   

The coyote thing has me confused.  I thought that counties could set up their own regs as far as controlled hunts and bounties. 

Why would Hudak punish Murdoch.  Hudak should be asked for a comment, but if he dumps on Murdoch that sends a weird signal to the rural ridings that are currently PC and tend to favour anti-GTA sentiment.

Rosie Dimanno weighs in.

Normally her columns are unmitigatingly offensive, but this one leaves me more bewildered than anything.

I enjoy the GTA.  I don't want to live there, but it's a fun place, and occasionally I feel the urge to go to the big city and lose myself, the stereotypical story.  I like people, and I love food, and the GTA has plenty of both (plus a rather large population of women).

Really, the cities and the countryside of southern ontario need to work more closely together instead of setting artificial boundaries or igniting the same old rural-urban arguments.

It's clearly a demographic challenge as well as lifestyle.  The GTA is certainly more diverse ethnically than the countryside and will only continue to grow in that fashion, and that fuels all kinds of redneck racism.  I really hope Murdoch\Hudak and the PC party does not play on this aspect of the discussion for political gain.

Rosie Dimanno is a scum bag, a total fuckwad. I hope to never see her in Grey County.

"In fact, bet there aren't half as many guns in Bruce County as there are in Scarborough. Just saying."

Another useless reporter making shit up.

Rosie Dimanno and her ilk are why people hate Toronto. Everytime I read any of her articles I just get angry, this one more then ever.I mean look the title. "Hick MPP can have all rural ontario" last time I checked Toronto isn't the only city in province. Dimanno is a fucking tool. I am a utterly ashamed she speaks for this city.

And some of us born in Toronto have migrated to the hinterlands.

By the way I love Toronto and almost all Torontonians (DiMano now being a notable exception) and think Murdoch is quite wrong.  Toronto is a cultural and economic driver of this great province.  Without it we in rural Ontario would be much poorer and not just in monetary terms.

Yeah, much south of that, and you've got all the Torontonians on vacation and transplanted Torontonian retirees. :D

Coyote(s) attacked a man last night in Dundalk, Ontario (Southern Grey County). It was likely one captured from Toronto and the release in the Grey County.

I'm not sure how Torontonians are to blame for coyotes...where does that come from?

I can see how trapping them and then releasing them in a rural area could be considered dumping them somewhere.  But I don't really get what else you can do.  It's a bad thing to release wild animals back into the wild?  You can be sure that the coyotes weren't born in Toronto, so obviously we're not just creating coyotes to plague rural folks with.

What's the solution?  Kill them?

I think the Dimanno piece was intended as tongue in cheek, and I think there were a few comments that were on the mark that way.  But a few displayed the kind of ignorance/arrogance we more often ascribe to some pundits on Faux News.

Dimanno isn't aware that Toronto already exports it's garbage to rural Ontario, and that decisions or non decisions of the GTA council do in fact impact rural areas.   For example: if windmills are such a good idea, how come there aren't any on the Scarberian Bluffs? or all along the lakeshore, for that matter?   

Murdoch and Dimanno are cut from the same cloth.

Michelle wrote:

I'm not sure how Torontonians are to blame for coyotes...where does that come from?

I can see how trapping them and then releasing them in a rural area could be considered dumping them somewhere.  But I don't really get what else you can do.  It's a bad thing to release wild animals back into the wild?  You can be sure that the coyotes weren't born in Toronto, so obviously we're not just creating coyotes to plague rural folks with.

What's the solution?  Kill them?

ARG.

Maybe Torontonians should get to know their city.  There's at least three river valleys, the Humber, the Don and I think the Rouge?  And what's the one that goes through Oakville?  Credit?   Anyway.  These wild coyotes are living, appropriately enough IN A WILD AREA IN SIDE TORONTO.  

And yes I know I'm yelling.

So, I suggest people living next to those areas have pets that either stay in coyote free zones, or can handle themselves if they run into a coyote.    There's a reason some people refer to little dogs as "musky bait"  you know.

Coyotes were rare twenty years ago in my area - Haldimand-Norfolk.  Several of the oldest hunters I know - with around 60 years experience hunting in this land - have all kinds of stories of the ebb and flow of wildlife.  Coyotes in big numbers are new to them. 

They're being hunted right now.  The issue Murdoch is referencing, as far as I can tell, is whether or not to hunt more and whether to incentivize the kill but he's mixed that up with a bunch of good ole boy commentary.

I haven't seen anyone calling for a full death sentence cast on coyotes.  Got any links Kropotkin?

Toronto should deal with its own coyote population.  And with no predators and lots of food, I really doubt they'll do anything but grow in numbers.  I think the "catch and dump" is simply an idea and is not being put into practice.

That's for the GTA to deal with.  Murdoch is, I think, suggesting that GBO should be able to decide its own control measures.  Like hunting, trapping.  That's probably the best solution, because farmers could go over the top left to deal with coyote problems on an individual basis.

I like Kropotkin and TP's thinking: Toronto is wild.  Places like Milton back right into the protected areas of Halton. 

There was an great interview about coyotes on CBC radio in the winter.  The show, the Current I think, spoke with a coyote expert who says bigger coyotes are moving into our area.  The smaller, traditional coyote for southern ontario was small, like a big cat, 25 pounds.  A much larger animal is moving into the area and will eventually there will be bigger coyotes, with a bred in ontario demeanor. 

No question the reintroduction of the wild turkey, and the subsequent population explosion, has helped the coyotes own population expand. 

Well, not only that but they have likely been pullling down young, old, sick and injured deer, or scavenging them.    And, we've increased wetlands either by accident (beavers making a comeback because there's little market for pelts) or design, creating lots of living space for ducks and geese and other marsh birds.   I mean, we created the menu for coyotes and more predators.   And, personally, I like it. 

The very same area where the Dundalk man offered his face to the Coyote to bite-- or wild dog, no one is sure which-- had a young black bear wander through... two springs ago.   And yes, there's photographic evidence, and I saw the tracks for myself.

The wild turkey introduction is remarkable.  I can't find the site anymore, but the actual introduction was quite small, and even the ministry was astounded as to how quickly they spread.  Heck, I've had a wild turkey in my yard here in London.  So, the coyotes will move in, their population will explode for a while, untill the turkeys and deer populations get smaller and a bit smarter and there will be a new equilllibrium, and by then we'll know enough to lot leave our pink and mauve poodles out in the back yard unattended.

I wondered when I logged onto babble whether there would be a thread on Bills's comments and sure enough

Bill, who I've known for years and years, is a populist, he knows what buttons to push and is unafraid to push them.  I expect he was only half serious, and is laughing himself silly this has gotten so big.  I think what people forget is that there are small town people who are as clueless as their big city cousins in terms of the concerns and realities of farming (whom Bill was actually speaking too) just as there are big city folks who know a great deal about the problems facing farmers and how dysfuncitonal our food system too.  Ignorance and knowledge does not depend on geography.

Bill does make a point when he says that there is a "Toronto mentality" to many of the decisions this provincial government in particular makes.  Cookie cutter solutions imposed without considering local needs happens all the time, including perversely in areas like agriculture.  It creates a legacy of resentments that have nothing to do with Toronto per se but where power is located.  If, say Toronto were to get hived off, then people like Bill and those he represents would eventually start complaining about the Peterborough, London, or Kingston mentality depending upon where the 'capital' and largest urban centres ended up being.  It would be inevitable.

Dimano and Bill come from the same place of ignorance.  The simple truth is we need each other.  But for most of us, regardless of where we live it is going to be a bit of a love/hate relationship because we need different things and have to compete for attention.  Sometimes it will be rocky, and other times it will be great, but we need each other.  Rural Ontarians need the tax base created by Toronto, while Toronto is only as successful as it is because of all the things the hinterlands brings to it.  And that is just on economics.  I have often thought what we need is an exchange program for people of all ages to get to understand the different cultures both areas.

On coyotes- we have had several coyote attacks here on our farm.  We have had young calves killed within sight of the house.  Last summer coyotees broke into our chicken house and killed dozens and dozens of chickens.  Most were killed for sport as they were not eaten, just killed.  I am pretty down with all of God's creatures on this earth and will let bygones be bygones, but coyotees (and raccoons) are just evil incarnate.  Any population control is good population control for someone who has seen the damage these hateful things cause.  When I was a kid I remember once seeing a coyote.  It was a big deal.  Now I see them regularly and they are big &*ckers.  They have no fear of people, standing within feet of my tractor at times.  Last spring they destroyed an entire colony of turkeys on one of our rented farm.  They must have killed 20 turkeys and just mostly left them there.  Evil, evil, evil thrill killers.

Webgear wrote:

We had a vote today. The hamlet of Lindenwood is separating from Ontario and Canada

We are now an independent nation. We are now accepting alliances and trade agreements with all interested parties.

Fuck Toronto.

giggle

I am serious, what has Toronto done for me lately? Every summer I need spend a few days picking garbage of my land because some lazy fucker from the city is too lazy to head to the dump. He decides that my land is just as good for dumping his waste.

Toronto:

• Arts and culture
• FREE events all over the city
• Political actions out the wazoo
• The yummiest restaurants from many amazing cuisines, and not too pricey if you know where to go
• Personalized walking tours provided by cool, groovy Torontonians, if you're nice
• Toronto Island
• People-watching on College Street and Queen Street
• Groovy festivals during the spring and summer and fall (Jazz, Hot Docs, Pride, Word on the Street just to name a few. I think the coyotes have submitted something to the Fringe this year.)
• and.....Me!

Who can argue the fabulousness of that?

Nyah to bagkitty. Just because.

When we were on a cottage road we used to get everything from the weekend garbage bag, to propane tanks- sometimes with the bbq, cats and all kinds of 'stuff' so I know what you mean. 

I have had full bags of garbage from both Toronto and Brampton thrown onto my land.

Yes, there are rural people that do that same however it is not on the same scale as the city folks.