Whatever Happened to the Arab Spring?

Whatever you do don't call it the "NATO Spring" lest you be accused of denigrating legitimate resistance movements funded by the CIA and wild-wild west NATO outlaws.

Because that's what desperately poor people do when oppressed by foreigners - send "19 radicalized Muslims with boxcutters" no less to attack New York City and the Pentagon. It was just a matter of time before 19 of their freedom fighting jihadi mercenaries on the U.S. Government payroll gave them a helping hand.

If desperately poor people around the world didn't hate us for our freedums before 9/11, they surely do now. Because now we have a whole lot of freedums and more than our fair share.

The glasnost is half full.

Ken Burch wrote:

OK, Fidel, there may have been CIA meddling(we still need to abolish the CIA, after all).

Agreed, and we should work to abolish or dissolve NATO eventually, too.

Ken Burch wrote:

But are you actually saying there was NOTHING legitimate in the revolts?  That the people of those countries actually didn't want to be rid of the existing kleptocrats?

Thank you for the opportunity to explain. No, I am not saying that legitimate protests are staged by the CIA or anyone else. I think that the CIA and Obama's crew were informed that Mubarak would probably fall. Mubarak was a western stooge, but toward the end he began opposing the imperialist agenda for the Middle East.

I believe it was just another U.S.-backed regime change in Egypt with all the footprints of another US-backed regime change similar to the "Color Revolutions" in Georgia and Ukraine and Green Revolution against Ahmedinejad gone awry in 2009.

Ken Burch wrote:

Couldn't there have been the CIA, but also REAL people revolting for valid reasons?

Plus, desperately poor people are never helped or even cared-about by bastards like Mubarak or Assad.

That's right. But can you imagine a worse scenario for Egyptians,  Syrians, Byelorussans, Afghans and Iranians? Just look at Iraqis today - some have said the torture wasn't as bad under Saddam. And although I don't advocate for the Belarusan government, they would still be better off under the current corrupt regime than if they were to endure neoliberal economic reforms which would basically destroy the country and transform the region into another Yugoslavia or Egypt at some point. The new liberal capitalism is designed to first destroy economies which serves purpose numero deux if necessary, and that is to pave the way for NATO interventions.

When the people rebel, we are told that it is "Al Qa'eda" and terrorist groups perp'ing the violence. But they are ordinary people rebelling against intolerable economic reforms. "Al Qa'eda" terrorists are sometimes introduced to the region in order to confuse the situation and provide invitation to U.S. or European military interventions.

What Is the Muslim Brotherhood, and Will It Take Over Egypt? A Mother Jones article by Robert Dreyfuss

It's an eye opening article, Ken.

I am pretty sure that you are not pro NATO, Ken. For the record I don't know you personally but think you must be a splendid human bean from what you've posted on babble in this and other thread topics of discussion over the last few. Thank you, Ken.

And so all I can do now is continue clicking my clicker, palming therapeutic marbles, and be suspicious of the rest of you CIA plants. And you know who you are. bwahahaha

No that's not what I think about babblers, either. I think some of us on the left may be misled, though, into believing that 9/11 and other false flags since then really are the work of legitimate left wing-ish resistance movements. They want to believe that ordinary people did those things as a result of right wing oppression in the Middle East and Central Asia. IN their minds the hawks and vicious empire had it coming to them. Holy men acted on behalf of all of us in some sort of mission from God scenario. And that is complete bullshit - it is the imperialists own narrative, and we should reject it outright for lack of proof. 

 [u]I believe[/u] that even though long-time oppressed people such as Afghans whose countries have been invaded and occupied over time have never, not once, taken their fights to the invaders' homelands and dragged themselves down to the imperialists level. Real truth is at odds with the imperialists ersatz genesis fable at the root of the imperialists military agenda today.

I oppose imperialism, but it doesn't mean that I believe that pious Muslims are terrorists who perpetrated 9/11. There is no proof of that for one thing. No legitiimate court of law in the world would convict their own mercenaries for hire detained at the U.S. Navy base there at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.

Says who, you? There is no proof obtained by forensic or other investigations that says pious Muslims hijacked any planes whatsoever on 9/11.  The U.S. Gov is full of shit. According to FBI director Rob Mueller. they have no proof of any of the alleged hijackers true identities. They have nothing except for a few confessions from former anti-communist mercenaries for hire who once fought for the CIA in 1980's Afghanistan. And that might be useful except for the fact that confessions extracted under torture are not considered proof of anything in a legit court of law.