Iran 3

Very snarky, Paladin1. Perhaps before we have to offer anyone in the world the humanitarian offer of safety in a new country, we should avoid stoking war and devastation in the lands where the live and love.

According to Hajizadeh, the Iranian military are ready to target two US bases and one carrier in the event of an armed conflict.

"Al-Udeid base in Qatar, az-Zafra base in the UAE and a US vessel in the Gulf of Oman would be targeted if Washington took military action," the commander said.

...excuse the double posting (Te Fires, the Catalyst?) focusing on the Houthis new gained powers to destroy SA´s oil infrastructure.....

Recently read via globalresearch a credible report that the projectiles hitting the oil plant and field was directed from the northwest, Iraq or Iran, both countries vehemently denying so!

Also recall a recent attack in Syria coming from Northern Iraq, denied by their Government, which in truth was an Israeli missile (s). From their baser of operations in Kurdistan.

Quo Bono...no doubt Israel (Netanyahu) is desperate for mid east global conflict...

The message from Duff, via NEO suggests it may in fact have been an Israeli missile.

No doubt the Houthiis claimed responsibility and in fact may have launched their 10 drones, to be piggybacked by Israeli Intelligence and subsequent attack, reminder of their coordinated? attack on 9/11 on the backs of the Saudi conspirators?

Speculations as all are on this...but something needed to be put on the table for further investigations.....

The drone strikes on Saudi Arabia appear to have been successful in demonstrating that the US shield does nto work and the price for war with Iran would be high. Saudi Arabia appears to be backing away quicklyfrom a conflict.

Proof that the attacks came from Iran are either not relevant (see my first point) or uncertain. The idea that coming from the North proves anything is false - they could have gone around and down over water (yes the distance claim is also false) or they could have come from Iraq. Certainly Iranian allies in Yemen and Iraq would have good reason to prove that the price paid for an attack on Iran would be high. Also pressure on Iran is high and the regime there is a multiheaded one without a single entity in charge (there are two government structures - onethe RG and the Mullahs and the other through the elected government and that is in addition to the external allies not controlled as centrally as some may think).

The false flag claim on this one is not credible since proving the US shield to be ineffective is not soemthing anyone else would want to do. The attacks proved an important point about the vulnerability of Saudi Arabia that might have avoided a serious war.

Hopefully the Saudis will back down more and the US will as well. The people being hurt the most are not the government and the people being hurt the least in government are probably the hardliners. Sanctions are biting the people but the regime itself has ways through them so is not as desperate as the people. This aggression on Iran is really counter-productive in every way possible, strengthening the worst and weakening the best. Also the US has no plan for what would follow any regime change and if by some US dream it came true the result may be worse than what is there. Typical for US involvement in the Middle East and Central Asia.

NDPP wrote:

Gallup: 'Which Country is the Greatest Threat to World Peace?'

https://twitter.com/CarlZha/status/1188351305820934144

"Americans feel threatened by Iran because they can't find it on a map. What's Canada's excuse.?"

Canada follows America. Their enemies are our enemies. Most know nothing and could care less.

Interesting -- any country that would choose as the greatest threat a country without nuclear weapons. Mind-blowing really.

Interesting also is the opinion of Iceland often considered to be one of the least propaganda countries without a military. They consider the US the greatest threat.

Still, let's remember this is first past the post and the opinion of Iceland and Canada may not even be that different. I think many Canadians would have given the nod to the US - and even more now that you can see how their system works more clearly with a deranged leader. The US is by far the most aggressive powerful country in the world

So what's going on there right now?

The IRG is hated and very corrupt. Most people there believe that the IRG is the chief smuggler of Iranian gas out of the country (it is subsidized and chealer than surrounding countries).

The people there are very angry that the regime as it runs out of money still puts priority on everything elese befor ethe people.

The sanctions are not popular in part becuase there is little hope that they will break the regime.

Iranians close to me are telling me that they are frustrated that people are dying and it is still a minor story here. Some are wanting to demonstrate to get attention to the people who have been killed but there is fear of being seen. There will be some demonstrations in Canada Sunday but I do not know if anyone I know is going.

I am hearing some wonder just how much of this is is organic and how much even planned by the regime itself to flush out and vacinate the regime... Imposible to tell. People are furious with the corruption and this has been building for a long time. The handling of the floods earlier this regime was also considered very corrupt and the changes the government made to water flow management a cause for much of the devastation.

There is a lot of anger and not really all that much hope. Nobody thinks either the government or Trump are interested in helping them. Some appeal to Trump to help them with internet (US says they have the means) but expectations are low.

One person I was speaking to yesterday said that she was talking to someone on the outskirts of Tehran and there were people shooting protesters out of helicopters.

It does appear that some internet is being restored.

Things are bad and getting worse.

That is what is happening.

NDPP wrote:

Amnesty International 'Not Credible' on Iran - Tehran Professor

https://youtu.be/ceV4Jp5riBQ

"Professor Mohammad Marandi joins Rick Sanchez from Tehran to explain the diverted and 'paradoxical' claims made about Iran by Western politicians and pundits as well as Washington's increasingly aggressive drive to undermine Iran..."

Of course. But let us add the context. He is a supporter of the government and a son of a parliamentarian. It would be newworthy if he disagreed with the government. He is not an independent observer.

Sean in a conflict between the US and the Iranian government the US is the foreign interventionist and that must be condemned. The principal of sovereignty of nations is something that NATO no longer respects but I do. The Iranian, Lebanese and Hong Kong people all cite corruption as one of the things that has brought them into the streets. All the regimes are in some manner or other tightly controlled capitalist states. Around the world people are up in arms about their politicians being bribed and corrupted while doing public business. Look in the mirror Canada we are the problem because our corporations are some of the most corrupt and brutal in the world.

Of the 608 companies and individuals listed on the World Bank’s just-released blacklist for fraudulent or corrupt conduct, 119 are Canadian companies. But engineering firm SNC-Lavalin and its subsidiaries, many of which are registered outside Canada, comprise 16 per cent of the total.

The World Bank bans companies from participating in aid and development contracts if they “have been sanctioned under the Bank’s fraud and corruption policy.”

The number of companies included on that list soared in 2013, rising from only 65 banned entities on last year’s list, according to the South China Morning Post. The World Bank says about $40 billion of the roughly $200 billion it has given out since 2008 has been stolen.

Companies with head offices listed in Canada, which does not include overseas subsidiaries, comprise 119 names on the World Bank list, the most of any country. The U.S. is second with 44 debarred firms, Indonesia third with 43 and Britain close behind with 40.

The grounds for getting blacklisted vary, but usually include some manner of bribery, fraud, collusion, coercion or obstruction either in bidding for contracts or in carrying them out.

https://o.canada.com/news/snc-lavalin-canadian-companies-world-bank-blac...

Canadian lovers of freedom and democracy don't protest the corruption of our companies and the politicians they have on speed dial, they re-elect them. Even on this board we have many who aremore concerned about the impact on Canadian jobs than on the corruption in our own public tendering process and the immense harm our ruling elite is doing around the world by the export of those kinds of corrupt practises.

Then there is the mining industry that has facilitated coups throughout Central and South America in the last decade. It is a brutal industry and it is very, very Canadian. 

In October 2016, The Justice and Corporate Accountability Project (JCAP) published a report documenting incidents of violence associated with Canadian mining companies in Latin America. This study is the first of its kind, compiling information over a span of 15 years from 14 countries in South and Central America about violence associated with Canadian mining companies. With 41% of the large mining companies in Latin America being Canadian, it shows that a lack of accountability that these companies take for their actions abroad to be extremely problematic. Neither the Canadian government nor the industry itself are recorded to be tracking or reporting on violent incidents which affect Indigenous Peoples, and all people, throughout Latin American Countries.

 

Mining around the world often intrudes on Indigenous lands, and has since times of colonization. JCAP’s report identified 28 Canadian companies involved in these issues, and reported on at  least 10 detailed conflicts  in  which  Indigenous people were victims of violence and criminalization stemming from a mining corporation.  From the 14 countries that were analyzed, there were 44 deaths overall, 30 of which were labeled as “targeted.” There were also 403 injuries, occurring in events such as protests and confrontations related to the mining, 709 cases of criminalization, and a widespread geographical distribution of documented violence in all countries. Deaths, injuries, warrants, and arrests specific to Indigenous People in relation to Canadian mines occurred in 8 of the 12 countries and 73% of the women who were recorded as being sexually assaulted as a result of the Canadian mining corporations were Indigenous. Data shows however, that the Canadian companies from this study reported on only 24.2% of the total deaths and 12.3% of the injuries that were documented in the report.

https://www.culturalsurvival.org/news/canada-brand-violence-and-canadian...

I am convinced that the Iranian system is far far less than ideal however I am not convinced the harm it causes people is any worse than our system. The big difference is we Canadians like to externalize our costs to other countries and merely clip the coupons from our investments on the TXS and tsk tsk about evil governments around the world.  The Iranians are to be praised for taking to the streets but lets not lose sight of the underlying imperialism that permeates all conflicts and protests, especially the ones that become violent.

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

I am too close to Iranians directly affected to take your position.

I do condemn the US position but I simply cannot for a moment pretend that the harm being done to the Iranian people is no worse than here. You are misinformed or blinded but completely off base here. 

There is no clean side in this and the Iranian regime is deeply damaging its people. 

But what you are saying is laughable - really.

The bolded part is where you misunderstood what I was trying to say. There is no doubt that the Iranian government is  more brutal towards its own people than our government is with the settler population of Canada. However the Canadian oligarchy that controls our government is actually responsible for more death and destruction in the world than the IRG but the people dying are not Canadian so we don't count them as marks against our democracy the same way as we count all the crimes the Iranian oligarchy commits against its own people. Canada exports the hurt is my point. Our vicious ruling elite beats up and suppresses Latin Americans and slaughters Libyans but their police don't normally beat up people, in most protests in Canada, unless they are anarchists.

I don't think we disagree on how bad the theocratic tyranny is in Iran its just that I think my own ruling elite is every bit as evil and more powerful and thus able too cause greater harm.  The people of Brazil, Venezuela , Ecuador, Honduras, Haiti Bolivia have all suffered death and violence by fascists working on behalf of our Canadian ruling elite and the ruling elites of other NATO countries.

When people are dying in the streets we do not need to keep bringing up a global context out of proportion to what is happening there. I do not think every comment has to be judged as requiring a comparison between the US based system and whatever is going on in terms of harm. We already know the US is the most powerful country in the world and engages in imperialism but this serves to dismiss or minimize what is happening in in every single context if we have to imediately say tough for you but the US is the story. We have many threads in the echo chamber to bat around the comments about the US -- not every thread has to be a competition to see who brings up this reality first and best. These countries in their context matter as well and not only as examples of what the US is doing wrong in the world.

This smells of what-aboutism. What people in Iranian are facing does not need a global US condemnation to bookend every single recognition of what is happening. It can be recognized and the US role can be taken and examined in terms of how it affects them. We do not need to put up the whole catastrophe  of US effects on the world to respond to every single thing that we ought to notice in each country. Otherwise why not just have one single thread on the bad USA and not bother recognizing anything else?

An American killed, 4 injured in heavy Iraqi Shiite rocket strike on US K-1 base near Kirkuk

Dec 28, 2019 @ 11:33 Mike Pompeo, PMU attacks US base, US K-1 base in Iraq

At least 30 rockets launched against the US K-1 base near the oil city of Kirkuk in northern Iraq on Friday, Dec. 27, killed an American civilian contractor and injured 4 US soldiers. Some 11 to 14 exploded inside the base; the rest outside. They were fired from rocket-launching trucks parked outside the facility. The crews then abandoned the launchpads and took off in waiting getaway vehicles.

DEBKAfile’s military sources report that analysis of the shrapnel quickly identified the Iranian-made rockets that are supplied to their Iraqi proxy, the Popular Mobilization Units (PMU), whose commander Abu Mahdi al-Muhandis, is a deputy of Al Qods-chief Gen. Qassem Soleimani.

According to our sources, the PMU rocket attack was Iran’s punishment for the month-long US aerial offensive for breaking up the Iraqi Shiite militia concentrations around Abu Kamal and Deir ez-Zour near the Syrian border with Iraq, According to a division of labor, the US Air Force has targeted the  Der ez-Zour contingents and Israel, the units present around Abu Kamal and up to Palmyra.

Urgent consultations began in Washington on Saturday for a decision on how and when the US should retaliate for the attack on the K-1 base. The US maintains some 5,000 troops in Iraq.

On Dec. 13, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo issued a strong warning that any attack by Iran or its proxies that “harm Americans, our allies or our interests will be answered with a decisive US response.” He was reacting to more than 10 rocket and mortar attacks against US military facilities in Iraq and the US embassy compound in Baghdad. Three days later, Defense Secretary Mark Esper repeated this warning in a conversation with Iraqi prime minister Adel Abdul-Mahdi. Not much can be expected from Baghdad since both the prime minister and this week the president have handed in their resignations over the turmoil generated by two months of protests that have paralyzed government.

...Note this message is from DEBKA, allied to Mossad...so the info may be lies, but with one objective...to force US (and Canada) into war with Iran...

and from zero hedge...their latest....

US Conducts Air Strikes In Iraq And Syria, Targeting Iran-Backed Militia After US Contractor Killed

The U.S. military conducted air strikes in Iraq and Syria against the five facilities controlled by the Kataib Hezbollah militia group in response to the killing of a U.S. civilian contractor in a rocket attack on an Iraqi military base, US Central Command said on Sunday. A U.S. official told Reuters that the strikes were carried out by F-15 fighter jets.